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In Henry IV part 1 Glendower says he will call ‘spirits from the vasty deep’ – the sceptical Harry Hotspur irritates the verbose Welsh prince by sneering: ‘aye, but will they come when you call?’ That’s a question facing every evangelist. From what I can see of the American scene, and from some British examples, a good deal of energy and thinking is put into this – hence the mega-church phenomenon and the emphasis on certain types of music as being likely to pull in people, especially young ones. But we are, as I suggested yesterday, effectively operating in a post-Christian society, where neither the education system nor anything in mainstream culture actually helps prepare people for the Word. Too often you end up with simplistic slogans which people imbibe and they say they are ‘saved’ and have ‘assurance’, and to anyone who asks serous questions quoting the Bible, they say that the ‘unsaved’ can’t understand the Bible – thus closing themselves off from fellowship with anyone but those few who agree with them.
Christianity is not a solitary faith, would be my first port of call – we have no examples in the New Testament of a man claiming ‘I am saved’ and not having fellowship with other Christians. I am deeply suspicious of those who have no fellowship with others because that is not the model we see in Scripture. Hermits may be a part of the longer history of the Church, but I see none of them in the NT, and no call for them. We are called to up and doing. That’s not a ‘works’ theology, it’s a simple fact of Christian life. If you claim to know Jesus and you are no better in your behaviour and your life for it, then your faith is, at best, theoretical, and at worst, a sham. The very idea that you can know the Savour of the world and yet it have no effect on you – except that you go round telling other folk you’re ‘saved’ is, to my mind, blasphemous. I never knew a man or woman who was not changed by the encounter. That’s not saying they, or me, suddenly became a perfect person, or, this side of heaven, ever could be – but it is to say we try, we’re conscious of our sin, we strive to do better. Not, pace idiots who talks about being ‘saved by works’ (has anyone ever met anyone who actually taught this?) because we think that is the way to salvation – but because if we know him it manifests itself in our lives.
Not once, in the whole of the NT, will you find anyone being told about having a ‘private’ relationship with Jesus – not one Apostle says to anyone that they must take Jesus into their heart and accept him as their personal saviour. We are saved into a community of faithful – as every Apostle and disciple was. Of course that means that we develop our own relationship with Jesus – how could we not? But that develops as part of a community of disciples – saints, as Paul calls them – who help each other on their journey. Private little relationships with Jesus, all by our wild lone, are not Biblical – our relationship, whilst personal, is as part of a community – the centre of gravity of that relationship is the called out community – Scripture offers us no examples of ‘saved persons’ with no relationship to the church. In fact, such a thing was impossible, because all the evangelists warn of the dangers of false prophets and emphasise the need to hold on to the tradition inherited by word and in writing. No ‘saved person’ by himself, had access to either – you got them through the church.
Paul is very clear about this. He calls the church the temple of the Lord where “you also are being built together into a dwelling place for God by the Spirit” (Eph. 2:21). Again, Paul prays that “you may be filled with all the fullness of God” (Eph. 3:19), which he already said resides in the local body (1:23). This is why God gave us spiritual gifts (Eph. 4:11-12), so that the body of Christ would be built up, made mature, and become unified where the “fullness of Christ” would radiate (Eph. 4:12-13). There is nothing in this, or indeed anywhere in Scripture, which posits a relationship with Jesus outside of the church. Water baptism, not some ‘sinner’s prayer’ was the instrument of reception into the Church for those who had come to know Jesus. The modern nonsense about it being individualistic is simply a heresy of our atomised society where everything is about ‘me’ and not me serving Jesus and building up his community on earth with others..
Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
Sounds personal to me.
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Bosco, dear, you are making Geoffrey’s point for him, since the angel in Revelation is talking to the the Church in Laodicea. So these are not random trolls in clown costumes.
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Who ever you are Eccles, you are thick as a brick.
if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him
Hes saying…if any man….that means any man on earth and among the heaven above. Its not just to one group. Nice try though, dim wit.
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You simply don’t get it. If you were a light bulb you would be 25 watts – that’s how dim you are.
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That much??? I thought his bulb was burnt out.
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He has no response to what I wrote except to cut and paste something he fails to undertstand.
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I fear he is more to be pitied than admonished, my friend.
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We’ve spent a long time pitying him. I have prayed on this and the answer, I am told, is to call him out. He will wriggle, he will repeat his nonsense, but I shall pursue him as long as he wastes our time here.
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That is one course and I would agree with that. The other, which I favor, is banning him from the site as it is nothing more than distraction and about as useful an exercise as it is for my dog to chase his tail.
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I can understand where C is coming from, and as the one evangelical Christian who regularly posts here I feel it is my job to expose him. He’s seriously deluded, he is misguided, whether he is being misled by a demon, who can say, but he has no good fruit to bear – and so is, at best, a barren branch to be chopped off and burnt.
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Not just a branch, Geoffrey, he is the fig tree that will not bear fruit. We’ve all tried to prune him . . . and if C thinks this still possible and he can till the soil so that it will produce fruit then it is commendable. I am more of a notion that you let it wither and take it away from here . . . roots and all.
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OK good brother Jeff, what don’t I get. Help me out here.
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The post spells it out. Read the quotations from Paul to the Ephesians. Stop being a lazy soul – Paul says we work out our salvation – so get working – all you are being asked to do is read.
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By the way, that’s not an angel talking. Its red letter…its Jesus talking. But, what do you care either way. You hate Jesus.
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21 And the eye cannot say to the hand: I need not thy help; nor again the head to the feet: I have no need of you.
Isn’t this your argument, Bosco? You not only don’t have need of others in the Church but you don’t even believe that they are part of the Body of Christ.
I doubt you are the eye in the Body of Christ, however, but you might be the toe jam.
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Each member has a purpose. We don’t have to all be holding hands. One plants, another waters. The Spirit has it under control.
The State run religion claims the Spirit guides them. All one has to do is read the newspapers to see that isn’t the case.
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So your ‘church’ is a void that cannot be seen and does not call sinners to Christ, has no binding teachings, and is not a community of souls working for the Kingdom? It is only fantasy, unseen, vapid, empty . . . to which you claim the Holy Spirit is what binds you. If that be so, I might claim that my dog is a member of this unseen body as well . . . it has as much credulity as your claim.
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We do have teaching…its called the KJV. Only we believe what it says.
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That thieves steal documents of value and have not the wisdom or intelligence to understand what it is they read and thus spread error wherever they go is not a valid excuse . . . you are still a robber and a liar.
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You don’t, since it says plainly all disciples are part of the church. It never says anyone is saved by a personal revelation by himself. You say this, you blaspheme. You parrot the Bible, you neither know its meaning nor its author.
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I never have said I had some revelation. If you can find where I said that, cut and paste it here and I will go away and never come back. If you cant find it, I want you to publicly admit that you have altzimers late stage disease.
I have said the same thing every time. I was changed.No matter how much that pisses you guys off, I was changed.
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I wouldn’t waste my time looking over your trash for the past 3 years. But why don’t you write a long detailed story of how you came to Christ and how you came to think that you are saved. Is is a feeling . . . . is it a assurance a person gave to you . . . . or are you somehow wanting to believe that it is true? Tell us your conversion story and set us all straight.
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You bear no good fruit at all. Show us some good fruit, show us some fellowship – or stop pretending you are a Christian.
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The only sigh you get is the sign of Jonas.
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So now you’re Christ?
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Each member is joined to the body – you are not – at best you are a twisted limb cast out.
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How would you know? Youre still on the outside looking in.
No time like the present. Today is the day of salvation,….hearden not your heart.
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I took Jesus into my heart when I was 10. I know a fellow Christian, and when you become one, I shall know.
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Which shows how you use the words of Scripture and twist them to your own damnation. Every person we see converted joins a church – they don’t just call in from time to time. This is why you are a fraud.
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Converted to a religion, you should say. I can understand catching flak from all the religion hoppers here, but its odd coming from you my brother.
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I am a Christian, like all the apostles and saints, I am part of a body of believers – are you?
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I like to think im part of His body. Every Christian doesn’t do the exact same thing. If you were born again, you would believe my report. But you don’t believe my report and you say I have a demon. The servant is not above his Master.
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It is because I am born again that I doubt it. No one was ever born again and not attached to a church. There is no example in Scripture, no example in history until some individualistic Americans began to make the idea up in the last century. it is false teaching and I call it out precisely because these six and a half decades I have walked with Christ. You can walk too brother, but you need a community of saints – you cannot do it alone. No one can, not even Paul and he was the greatest of all evangelists.
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Amen, Geoffrey. And as we read in 1 Timothy 3:15 “But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.”
If Bosco wants to point to the pillar and ground of the truth then he needs point me to the Church of the living God. He will probably say that he has nothing against churches but does have problems with religions. But then a local or particular church is a convocation of peoples who worship together and in turn are adhering to an even wider ‘religion’ or binding to a set of beliefs and standards. Without that, what do we have? Bosco’s word for it . . . and nothing else.
I would say though that John the Baptist might be the example of the hermit . . . though hermits usually have a wider calling in the Church after their days of preparation. They are not seperated from the Church though . . . they hold to a common set of beliefs and standards with others and any personal revelation is not simply for them but for the strengthening of the community; the church. For Christ founded a Church to be a visible manifestation of Himself remaining in this world to carry on His mission. To disassociate with Him or His presence in the Church is like saying I am married but I have never known my wife and have no idea where she may be found.
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Gods church is people. Born again people. There is no number in the yellow pages. No headquarters. No corrupt bank. No jail. No costumed pedophiles. You keep thinking the body of Christ has to be some organization with a flag and a creed no one follows.
Keep searching. I hope he finds you soon.
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So Paul did not establish particular churches, Bosco? Did your Bible lose those pages?
You seem to me like a person who makes public claim to half the winnings of somebody who just won the lottery because you say that person is your spouse. There is no public record of this and no evidence of this and we are to take your word for it. Best hope that the spouse of your soul doesn’t also disavow you publicly as well.
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Those 7 churches had some special purpose. Maybe more aware Christians know what the deal is with them. Jesus had some bone to pick with all of them but one. In case youre wondering, none of his churches were in Rome.
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Of course they had problems . . . the same ones the Church will deal with until his second coming. What do you think . . . we are magically made righteous and nobody sins or finds themselves in error any longer? The ‘special purpose’ was to spread the Good News and gather together a new People of God. That you are so confused by all of this is an indication that the father of all lies and confusion has tried to have you believe that there is no Church as he would have you believe that there is no sin or that he does not exist and (if perchance he did) you are immune to his attacks.
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So, when Paul writes to the saints in Rome you don’t believe there were any? Thou art a wicked and fruitless branch and thou shalt be cut off and cast into the flames. Christian, don’t make me laugh. You are the tool of Satan – get behind me.
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You guys ask me to show you where the NT talks about being saved. The word saved is just short for…saved from the wrath to come. The followers were called saints. Of course there were saints in Italy, you ninny.You claim I didn’t know that then berate me because I didn’t know, or so you fantasized that I didn’t know. So what? Why would that make me a bad person anyway? Saints fanned out from Judea to all the western world. And they spread the good word.
You guys damn me to hell because I don’t hang out with the saints in my area. Is that the best you can do? And condemnation from people who belong to a cult where people bow down befor the works of their hands….that is priceless.
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No, learn to read. I ask where it says you get saved by yourself apart from the community of saints. What makes you a fraud is your claim you know Jesus – I have known him for more than sixty years, and your fruit is not that of the Lamb.
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Id like to hear your testimony. So, where were you and what were you doing the moment you were born again? Thanks in advance.
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I was on the moors near the chapel and I was troubled. I had had a row with my father because he was being mean to my mother. She went to the chapel and he was not a Christian, and he did not want her to go that morning. I told him he was a bully and that if mum could not go I would – he said ‘chance would be a fine thing, your going to be a little heathen like me’. I left, very angry. Half way across the moor I stopped. I knelt down and said ‘Jesus, I am a sinner, if you are real, make this anger go away’. I felt a sense I feel to this day – my sins melted away with my anger, I knew I was forgiven, though I did not even know what that meant – my sins felt as nothing, and when I got to the chapel, the Minister said: ‘Geoffrey, I can see thou art not troubled – be not afraid, God is with you.’ Frankly I had no idea what he was talking about – all I knew was that I felt no anger – and I wanted to devour the whole Bible at one sitting. I went home after the service, told my father I forgave him, told my mother I loved her, went to my room and spent the next month reading the Bible. I’ve done so every day of these last sixty four years. That’s my testimony.
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Well, that sounds like a good one. Thanks for that.
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My pleasure.
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When I was born again, I wasn’t in a group. I didn’t even know I was born again. But I was driven to read the bible the next morning. And every day after that. I still didn’t know what happened. It was maybe yrs later that I realized I was born again. I didn’t know there was a name for it. But I was led to a local group of saints, ithought by accident, but it wasn’t.
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Nor was I, but like Paul and like every born again person, I went into a church and was part of it – that is how it works.
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Yes, that is how it works.
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Yes, people, not isolated individuals who occasionally go to church. I pray you get saved in the way the NT says, not the way the demon in you tells you. You don’t see it. You are being misled and you will end in hell. Of course your demon will tell you otherwise – what else would he tell you? You are a fool. You have been told, and you will not hear.
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You have a good point there. I really should attend the gatherings more often. I already feel bad about that, but I doubt if im going to hell because of that.
Go to Church? I am the church. Where I am, the church is.
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No, show me once, just once, where Jesus says an individual is the Church. You can’t, because you lie.
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Ill have to get back with you on that. My time on the computer is short now. Ill find it later.
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I can save you the trouble. There is no such place.
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Geoffrey – I do not intend to defend Bosco in any way. I have seen his web page. He has demonstrated that he has a mind attracted to filth and which revels in filth. This does not look to me like someone who has ‘died to sin’ and finds it abhorrent to continue to live in sin.
But on the matter of not going to church – there are very often situations where it is the only serious option. For example – Philip Augustine has described below a situation where any Christian idea of fellowship with other Christians is entirely lacking and hence I simply don’t see the point of going to such a church. If there isn’t some sort of interaction (praying together over issues of common concern regarding the mission at home and abroad would be one of the main issues) then I really don’t see any point.
When I was younger, I was in a situation where I was bullied by people saying roughly the same thing as you into going along to church, even when every church service was worse than pulling teeth. After several years of this, towards the end of 2001, I took the view that I wasn’t going to be blackmailed and bullied any longer into attending duff church services. If there was a decent church, I was obliged to go along; if each church service was worse than pulling teeth, then I wasn’t.
After taking that decision (after several years where each Sunday was awful because I felt obliged to go to church each Sunday no matter how awful), I would go on lovely long walks in the countryside, past lakes and through forests, between 15 and 20 miles long. I found this a much more peaceful and serene Spiritual experience than attending a lousy church where they didn’t seem to know their posterior from their elbow.
There do exist situations where the churches are all duff and I don’t believe that we are under obligation to go to church under such circumstances.
What concerns me is evangelism, spreading the gospel. If there isn’t a decent church in the area, then it makes evangelism much more difficult, if not impossible. Following the pattern of the apostle Paul, when he was street preaching, people who heard him decided to come to the synagogue (when he was preaching there) or the church to hear more of the matter. If we don’t have a decent church then the whole business of spreading the Word is much more difficult.
But Christians can survive in such a situation – after all, Elijah was in isolation for three and a half years.
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I take your point, but there is no example in Scripture of an individual coming to Christ and not being part of a community. Sometimes people do not take the trouble to try to get behind the local church – when they do they often find they can make a contribution. It must be difficult in a foreign country where, perhaps, most of the churches are not of our sort – but is there nothing to be done, are there none in the area who could meet in a house and pray and study scripture?
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I very much understand your situation Jock and it is not uncommon in these days of non-chalant attitudes toward God and worship. The Modernism of our world has penetrated far and wide even within the churches of Christianity. But I very much like Geoffrey’s response as well.
For my own part, I have handled this problem by adopting a frame of mind. That frame of mind is that Christ was not a masochist though He desired to even subject Himself to agony for our salvation. Am I not willing to endure 1 hour with our Lord, while He suffers the indgnities that we often see in parishes these days; the irreverence and indifference? This has sustained me as does the idea that unknown to me, if I show reverence when there is little to be seen, then Christ has won a small victory; for I cannot know if this has effected a change in another – perhaps a small child who has never seen reverence and solemnity before.
Then I have always offered my time to teach apologetics, adult education, RCIA or Catholic inquiry classes. If they accept my offer fine . . . and if they don’t or find out that I am too Catholic for their liking and want me to desist I do that as well. For instance, I used to have a prison ministry but it was pulled when the pastor saw that I did accept his novel gospel. All we can do is put forth the effort . . . then it is up to God to change minds and hearts. We can be part of a solution or we can steer clear and content ourselves with what our ancestors didn’t have: access to good sermons and good lectures online, bible studies we can read etc. It just isn’t the same to me. I think God wants us there even if we are nothing more than a thorn in their side or a flicker of light that might start a flame in the parish. 🙂
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I’d like to note that just because in my particular situation hasn’t happened the way I’ve desired, I still thirst for community. Is it true that I can survive? Yes. However, the survival is more like a fast or penance. It’s not a desirable state of being by any means. Which is why I’ve been planning on taking Catechist classes. I wish to serve my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.
In the end, is it not why we all gather here?
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It is indeed 🙂
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Thank you Jocky boy, for reminding me to update my homosexual site. Just 2 days ago I got help by yahoo to get into my email. It was hijacked or something. Now I can keep people up to date on the latest pedophile scandals of the state run religion
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Bosco is no Christian, and whoever he met, he needs to meet the real Jesus.
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Well I’ve met alot of people and supped with a lot of people and some might have been rather Christ-like. But there were far more that I had no intention of supping with again. It is not a sure-fire indication that you have had some encounter with Christ just because you think you have.
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He seems to be under the impression that a demon trying to lure him to hell would say ‘hey man, I am a demon, you can call me Jesus if you like, but I am really a demon; – man’s a fool.
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Im trying to manage my anger good brother Jeff.
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You need to let go of all anger – God is love, not anger.
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St. Bisto, most people’s anger derives from something that happened in early childhood.
Actually there are two things that happened:first, going back in time, is the Original Conscious Trauma; second, even further back the Original Unconscious Trauma.Until you deal with the Unconscious one you’ll still have you anger. This latter one can go as far back as in utero, as it did with my second wife.
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Geoffrey, as I pointed out to St. Bisto, letting go of anger is much easier said than done. It normally requires a modicum of therapy.
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Ah, the American answer for everything, including how a man man make money by peddling malarkey legally. You know, I’ve managed on this earth for nearly 75 years without once seeing a therapist, so has everyone I know. That means there are no rich therapists, or even poor ones nearby.
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David – could you briefly outline what form the modicum of therapy takes? If a therapist can be of genuine help to somebody, then I’m sure that it would be beneficial for the rest of us if we had some idea – so that we could be of practical value to people who need it.
Like Geoffrey, I’m a priori sceptical – everybody has issues and the grace of God should be sufficient to deal with them.
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Ill hold my breath and count to ten
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Not for any longer – don’t want you turning blue and fainting 🙂
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Since your brain works extremely , so do I, maximum of 10X2 hr. sessions, usually 8 sessions. It is secret therapy, which means you don’t have to tell me your stories unless you want to. My job is to allow you to have more options, possibilities by teaching you have to think differently. Most other therapists have the privilege of being verbally vomited on…not me. One hour sessions aren’t respectful to either client or therapist. If you need more than 20 hours there’s something wrong with me.
The British stiff-upper lip., “just buck up,” “get over it, or “pull your socks up,” only works for a few, unless you believe that all of us are the same. Basically, that belief system is from the ignorant Victorian Empire era. This includes the WWI “shell-shock” version of PTSD which neither the British nor the US VA know how to deal with. What they do is just plain EVIL.
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Odd isn’t it, hardly anyone in Britain goes to therapy and we’re fine, you have an industry and seem to be full of neurotics. Main difference seems to to be in the salaries of therapists. Can’t imagine why any Christian would need to go pay to talk to a stranger.
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I don’t see how it’s compatible with Christianity. When I come to Christ, isn’t there the Holy Spirit transforming me, renewing my mind, so that my thinking is in step with the Spirit? Shouldn’t that do more than any therapist can do? What is the role of the therapist?
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That’s my view too.
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I too believe that many a psychosis and neurosis is nothing but an outward coming out of hidden sin, excused sin, and unrepentent sin. And these can be worked out spiritually though sometimes it is useful for someone who has experience in these things.
Though I do think that therapists can be helpful, in uncovering that which has been buried and hidden from our conscious mind for years or for those imbalances of chemicals which wreak havoc in the area of bipolar disorders etc.
And then there are different types of therapists as David said. A truly Christian based therapist uses faith, scripture and Christ for the healing process: my wife was aided by this after her nervous breakdown (of a spiritual nature) and it wasn’t some long course of action that seems to just continuously separate the person from the money in their wallet. These folks are more like spiritual advisors than the run of the mill therapist that you seem to be speaking about.
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This is bonkers! So, according to this, your patient (who is paying for the privilege) can sit there is silence for two hours and, in some magical way, this ‘teaches’ them something. Come on, surely even you can see the scam there.
You still have not said what happens to people too poor to afford your rates, or without insurance – do they not suffer from these rarified problems? Only one think is the same – the ‘therapists’ taking money of the credulous.
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At first I was astounded at Geoffrey, Jock and part of Dave’s respones, then I had to laugh.
Geoffrey lives in perfect country, where you have to be crazy to go to therapist. Jock, beieves that if you’re a Christian you don’t need it. Dave has a sinful connotation.
To be continued later today.
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I guess I place too much emphasis on the ideas of Archbishop Sheen as I have been listening to one of his retreats this past week. The sinful connotations for the cause of psychosis and neurosis come from his talks – though, on my own, I have thought that this is a major cause for both.
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You are only astounded because you’ve been drinking the kool aid for so long you think it is tea. Odd the way the only people who seem to be able to access your ‘therapy’ are those who can pay – or do you do a lot of pro bono, you being a Christian and all?
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Have decided to write a longer comment and post it shortly. I’m gobsmacked by the comments so far.
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David – please do.
I don’t agree with Dave Smitn’s view; you have indicated that you treat people traumatised by war experiences – and the trauma cannot possibly be associated with their own sin.
I do believe, though, that if the Christian faith means anything at all, it means that we have the Holy Spirit living within us who is a much more powerful counsellor than anything a therapist can offer (no matter how good).
One of the problems you have here is complete ignorance – I for one have no idea what this psychotherapy involves, or who it is for. More importantly, if it really is useful, then you may well have things to say for anybody who finds themselves in a pastoral role (and we all find ourselves in this situation from time to time).
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Reality breaking into a fantasy world does that. For the whole of Christian history we’ve been able to do without kool aid salesmen, and most of us still do – and the kool aid salesman is gobsmacked – go figure!
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I hope C will print my two part comment separately. The Whys and Hows of Therapy.
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Note that I am only speaking of a some types of mental dysfunction as being primarily residing in the soul. I am aware that there are many other types of mental problems besides those.
Look forward to reading it, David.
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I’m not getting this. Is there some stuff only rich Americans, or Americans with good insurance suffer from – other than boredom and excessive materialism – which poor Brits don’t suffer from. I’ve never met anyone who had, or needed therapy such as DMW describes. Barnum was right – there;s one born every minute. what do the poor do in your country?
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There are such ‘real’ problems which exist that are physical or inherited, Geoffrey. Bipolar disorder is often caused by chemcal imbalance and therapy helps while they are dealing with depression until the right balance is found in their medication. Trauma or victimhood at a young age can be suppressed and come out like a piece of glass that was never removed from the body. At some point it manifests itself and is ejected. Such things can come out as schizophrenia and various other types of psychosis. Therapy for these folks is useful.
Do I think that we have over done it? Absolutely! Though, the whole world might be best seen as a civilazation that has gone quite mad. Sex, drugs and rock and roll along with a world that glorifies our sins is not conducive to mental health or good habits.
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I remain unclear why it is that only people who can afford treatment suffer from these things. Or are the poor who do given the treatment for free?
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Geoffrey – well, it’s only ever posh people who go to fee paying schools who become homosexuals. I remember (I was in Sweden at the time) when John Gielgud died and his obituary mentioned that he had this tendency. I said, ‘oh no; not another one’. My Swedish colleague said, ‘well, in Britain, if you want to become an actor, you have to go to a fee paying school, where they have penalistic education methods – and this is why so many English actors are that way inclined.’
I think we can extend the principle – people who have more money can waste it in ways that are psychologically harmful – hence in later life they need to visit a good shrink.
I don’t think that David deals with diseases of the rich, lucrative though that might be; I get the impression that he is dealing mostly with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, which soldiers (not very rich people) get after fighting in stupid wars that governments have decided to get involved in.
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I got the impression he wasn’t impressed with the treatment the vets get – not sure if he gives them it.
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I imagine that Obama has made sure to give away my money to anyone who has less than I do for whatever they want; including sex change operations. 🙂
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No doubt they had a long time in therapy too 🙂 That’s why we now have 50 shades of gender no doubt – every fruitcake must be humoured, not told to man up or, my new favourite, ‘get in the sea’ – which is, my youngest daughter tells me, fashionable in her set – though she thinks me senile not to have hear her add a word beginning with f before ‘the’!
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Never heard the phrase . . . I guess we’re just getting to too old to be with it anymore my friend.
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I think I was always without ‘it’ – much to ‘its’ pleasure – and mine! All my life we’ve managed with male and female – but now the therapists tell us there are many ‘genders’ – everyone a meal ticket for some charlatan. I don’t doubt some folk get confused – nowadays there seems almost to be a bonus in being so.
As it happens, we’ve a whole lot of lesbians down in Hebden Bridge, fine ladies all of them, but they seem to know they are women – and they like other women! Next time I buy bread down there, I’ll have to tell them they are being very old-fashioned!
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Well when we grew up there were only 2 genders and if you had a doubt as to which one you were then you looked in the mirror.
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Back seat of the local cinema was said to be the place for making sure 🙂
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So I hear. 🙂
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Try that in Belfast and someone would have chopped your hands off – I was quite shocked when I cam to the mainland and found that sort if thing went on! Shows he power of the deterrent I suppose – male hormones versus righteous wrath!
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Male hormones will usually will out. 🙂
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Hebden Bridge – is that the local nunnery or something?
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Ha! About 15 years ago the place began to fill up with them – fine lasses who have revived the local economy by spending like there’s no tomorrow!
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Goodness knows what that has to do with Christianity – still, if he wants to bore us to death, there’s no law against it.
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Geoffrey – I suspect that when he describes what he’s doing, he’ll probably end up describing exactly the sort of things you would say to someone who came asking for pastoral guidance on any matter – except that you wouldn’t charge money for it; you’d simply consider it as one Christian talking to another.
But I don’t want to judge it until I read it.
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If he’s honest, he’ll admit that most of what passes for ‘therapy’ is fashionable nonsense in which one fashion follows another as it turns out the last one didn’t work. When I was a young teacher, Freud was all the fashion, now it is something called CBT. I’ve seen it come, I’ve seen it go, I’ve seen it fail.
I’ll be interested in why it isn’t enough for a man or woman to turn to Christ and join a good church. Not one with dancing monks and ancient loonies prancing round in sandals.
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TWO parts?! Hope you explain how you help the poor for free – you DO do that, don’t you?
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Geoffrey, I let go your ignorant comment about therapy being malarkey, but this one I won’t,”Odd isn’t it, hardly anyone in Britain goes to therapy and we’re fine, you have an industry and seem to be full of neurotics.”
The underlying presupposition is the superiority of Englishmen. You lot are a bunch of WOGS!
Man, no conceit in your family…you got it all!
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Ummm ….. what’s wrong with being a Wog? Other than that – the term is delightfully dated – I don’t think I’ve heard it used since the late 1970’s.
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Lat time I looked, America was to the West – would that be Wiley Occidental Gentleman then? 🙂
Looking forward to these lengthy posts (and they will be, you can bet) – getting my ammo ready 🙂
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No, the underlying presumption is we know a kool aid salesman when we see one. You keep not telling us what happens to the poor – do they not suffer from these fancy neuroses – or do you of your charity treat them for nothing.
Playing the victim card may work with your dancing looney tunes in the Casa, but you must be a long time out of Blighty is you think any Englishman is going to swallow it.
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I’m pissed off one by your know it all superior attitude and impuning my integrity.
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Go find someone who cares about your feelings – surely there must be a fellow therapist who’ll give you cut rates? I note you have never answered my question about what the poor do? Do they not suffer from these fancy neuroses then? Get over yourself man.
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How I operate my business is between me and God.
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Sure – how you operate your business is a matter between yourself and God.
As for the rest of us, we’d feel more comfortable if there was some indication that it didn’t follow the principles of Voltaire’s ‘The Imaginary Invalid’.
If you have an effective way of dealing with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, then my respect to you. As Geoffrey pointed out, though, much psycho-therapy, particularly in the USA, is based on the principle that ‘every American girl needs her shrink.’
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I’m betting it’s a variation on the Wild West Medicine Show – he’s in Arizona after all 🙂
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When you bring it here, it is all our concern. I will take that as being yet another evasion by you of the question as to what you do pro bono for the poor. My money is on you treating women, vets (who have insurance) and those who pay. I’m also betting you follow some oddball new therapy and will be lambasting other forms of it. Do you have your own Medicine Show – oldest three-card trick in the West.
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There she goes:

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This may be off topic a bit. I do have the Church; however, my personal church is lacking and to me impersonal. Every service has probably anywhere from 200-400 in the pews. The only time I speak to any of the three priests is briefly after mass or confession. I barely know any of my fellow Catholics. All of the bible studies or rosary groups are in the morning during the working day.
I was traveling one day and went to mass at the Cathedral at a Catholic University. I was reading the bulletin to see that they had night classes (mainly for students, but for all) about church fathers. I was envious. When I first joined my local parish I volunteered to do mass readings the survey that I doubt was read (perhaps, I should call and remind them?) The first week I received my offertory envelopes right away–with the wrong first name.
I shall pray about it.
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I am assuming your parish has at least 3 Masses on the weekend making the parish somewhere between 600 and 1200 persons. What is amazing to me is that you would have 3 priests unless you are at a parish that is being used by the Bishop to train younger priests or allowing retired priests to help out by saying Masses or giving some of the other sacraments etc. I think that it is important to know what is going on in that regard. My suggestion is to make an appointment to meet with the Pastor or invite him to lunch or dinner and speak to him about your concerns. What I have often seen is priest who have been beaten down by parishioners who will not participate in anything positive that they want to initiate. If he can get some support from a few zealous parishioners you could take a huge load off of his shoulders. So I would get all the facts first . . . and then you will know better what to do.
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Thanks for the kind words. I always suspect that many priests wish for friendship but there’s always some sort of barrier. It’s probably easier for the layman to reach out due to tension.
There’s four masses. Saturday Vigil, early morning, late morning, and evening on Sunday. The diocese’s website says there are 2,642 parishioners, although I’d suspect many do not attend masses regularly. My parish covers one of the large area Catholic grade school and high school. I always suspected that to be the reason for our three priests. We also have a seminarian so it may be used also for training too.
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Indeed, I never waited for priests to notice me as they may have more visitors than you might imagine and they’ve seen them come and go. I always invited them out for lunch or dinner. If they refused because of other obligations then I would try to pin him down as to when it might be convenient. It is important that you begin to understand the problems he may be encountering as well as voicing your own concerns: so it must be a conversation where we both speak and listen.
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Seems like the right ting to do.
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Do, it should not be like that – and in the larger churches too often is.
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