It was said of Churchill that his courage was such that he would have charged a manned battery of guns with just a rifle and bayonet; it might, it was added, be the wrong battery in the wrong place, but he would have attacked it all the same; his political career, with its strange mixture of triumph, disaster and ultimate triumph, illustrates the point well. It was loyal of him to defend Edward VIII, and romantic to imagine there could be a ‘King’s party’ to defend him; but it was also political madness and reinforced the prevelant view that if Churchill had any judgment, it was mostly bad. This is by way of prelude to a final comment, for now, on the disturbances in the Catholic social media over the Synod.
Those Catholic theologians who tried to pull rank on Ross Douthat, have been met by him with a forthright response and, equally predictably, some of them have played the gender card and accused him of going after the one female theologian on the list; given her views, one can see why they preferred to play the man and not the ball. The claim by Massimo Faggioli that Douthat erred in saying development cannot contradict past Church teaching that ‘the true criterion is the Gospel’ is shockingly imprecise from a trained theologian, and makes one glad Douthat did not plead his own pride of caste and advise Faggioli to stick to what he know best. The Blessed John Henry Newman provided seven tests for authentic development, all of which require a teaching to be tested against what the Church has always taught. There are, of course, many, indeed legions, who would say that it is the Gospel which matters and it can contradict the Church; we call those Protestants usually. But perhaps Twitter is not Faggioli’s medium and we have misinterpreted; I hope so.
Douthat is correct, the conservative – that is the traditionalist – side has all the Catholic arguments on its side. I shall not rehearse his arguments, which are given full rein in the piece to which I linked earlier. But all of that said, I repeat what I wrote yesterday – which is that those on that side of the argument must be careful.
There is, in some quarters, a readiness to take any rumour on the Internet as proof that their own fears are right, and then try to frighten others. Thus, Rorate Caeli has decided on the basis of a report of a telephone call that the Pope is going to realise its worst fears; it is usually better to wait to see what is going to happen before trying to stir up discontent. But even if it is right, there is no change in doctrine, just in discipline, and the latter is always subject to change. If one wanted to get really Rigorist here, one might point out Jesus said nothing about annulments, so even having them breaks with what he clearly said; that’s the problem here, there is always someone would is more Donatist than you are. At a time when only the rich and powerful got annulments, the present process worked well enough; in many places now the thing is more in demand, it doesn’t. Proposing to make life less difficult for those faithful who take the difficult decision to seek an annulment (and I have not heard anyone who has sought one say it isn’t difficult, and as one who has, believe me, it is) is not changing doctrine, it is helping the sheep; isn’t that what shepherds are for? I think some people need to calm down and stop looking for heresy where there is none.
We all err, we all stray, we are all sinners. On this issue of the Synod it is clear that any attempt to rig it to get a Kaperite answer (if that is what went on) has not only failed, it has backfired. The Pope cannot now proceed by stealth, he has tried the strength of those who held his position (if it is his position) and the angel with whom he was wrestling has won – as He will always.
Reblogged this on Oyia Brown.
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QVO is right. When you disconnect the teaching (the intention) from the practice (one’s actions) you have a moral obligation not to subvert the internal meaning of the teaching by an outward appearance of contradiction.
“. . . there is always someone would is more Donatist than you are.” This was not a very sound statement within the context of what you are writing. For those who are remarried are not considered to be no longer members of the Church. So it is not a Donatist position at all, whether annulments are granted or not. It is a matter of protecting the Sacraments of marriage, and the Eucharist following the time-honored intention that to receive the Sacrament of Sacraments one must be in a state of grace; having no stain of mortal sin upon their soul. They have a path already to the Sacrament if they desire to go that route. If they don’t then why is it important for the Church to lower the bar for these folks whilst debasing the Sacrament of the altar?
I’m sorry some people get their feelings hurt (I wish I could get paid for everytime mine have been hurt over the course of my life) . . . but Christ had more than His feelings hurt, as did many a saint and martyr for these 2000 years. Their fate even pales in consideration of the long-suffering of the poor, the diseased, the menatlly ill. Why is this so important? My opinion: it is important only because it opens the door to every aberration that is possible and eventually (having started with Communion in the hand, standing) they will de-value the Eucharist as only a ‘sign of communion,’ not with Christ, but with the other folks in the pews; another group hug, like we get at the Sign of Peace. Or, and this is also possible, the homosexualists within the Church are looking on numbing our consciences regarding their acts and their communion as Catholics in Good Standing . . . though they remain actively engaged in their sin.
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I take umbrage with your attitude of “group hugs” at Mass. I love them, especially if it’s with something soft and blond.
Remember as is in the Shul there was a separation between the plebs and the Rabbi/Priest in the sanctuary, we call it the Altar Rail. After VatII, we ran off the tracks, hence no more rails. Holy Communion could only be had standing and in the hand pre-dates on the tongue. Wafers are a modern invention.
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I have nothing against group hugs either David . . . just not during the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
Yes indeed the Bernardin crowd made sure that there was not a convenient way to receive communion on the knees and on the tongue . . . a bit of thuggery on their part I’d say.
Yes, they did take communion in the hand in days of old . . . but as our belief in the real presence developed and the horror of seeing the precious body and blood dropped and trampled under foot by the recipients the practice became reflective of our doctrine. The same is true about the wafer style of unleavened bread . . . it was a development to eliminate as far as possible the profaning of Christ in the Eucharist by crumbs that fell everywhere.
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But Dave, are you saying that in the early Church people did not believe it was the body and blood? I’d be interestied in evidence for that, as St Cyril of Jerusalem is quite clear that it is – and advises us to take great care for that reason. And back then, they used, as the Orthodox still do, actual bread. I am not a great fan of wafers, which seem to me to a concession to modern desires for convenience.
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We did, though we had not yet understood that every fragment, even unconsumed, was profaning our Lord. Are these reversions a development or a form of destruction from what has been developed?
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Not at all, Cyril of Jerusalem understood and said just that back in the 300s. Some chaps came along in the 400s with some novel way of doing this, which some clearly very liberal authorities allowed 🙂 That’s the problem with assuming that what has been done for a very long time has always been done. I don’t know when the novelty of the little wafers came in, but again, they are not what the Church used to do either. At one time, as you know, the Church allowed communion in one kind only, but again, that was not the practice of the early Church.
So, things change, and I’d guess there were a lot of people annoyed by the giving it straight on the tongue, and then the wafer business – that wasn’t how the Apostolic Church did it, so why change it – all these danged novelties 🙂
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You seem rather confused by novelty and development my friend. 🙂
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Well, as I said, on the tongue and using wafers were all, at one point, novelties, as, indeed, was using a Latin Mass. All came to be seen as developments, but all were opposed as novelties at the beginning – which is why we have to be careful here 🙂
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Of course we have to be careful . . . and these novelties that you bring up had plenty of support by sound teaching and by the treatment of things holy within scripture. The Church stood on solid ground. Some of these new ideas seem a bit more like quick sand to me.
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So the liberals of the time said, eventually grinding down the conservatives because they were in power. There is nothing in the Gospel which mandates communion on the tongue, it was theChurch which changed the way it was done. Kasper’s argument is that there is plenty of warrant in Scripture for mercy for the repentant. I am sure there is a difference, just not sure what it is, except you like one line and not the other. Yesterday’s liberalism becomes tomorrow’s conservatism.
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No, todays so-called mercy, is tomorrows victimization and persecution of somebody. Where that is how the world works and thinks, that is not how the Church has developed Her doctrine.
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I am not sure who is being victimised? Is anyone proposing to sack those bishops who opposed the Pope?
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I’m speaking of the loosening of the number of annulments that the Church has allowed in the past 50 years. .That was done, supposedly for the sake of mercy. But today . . . it takes too long and some don’t get their annulment. So now they are victims and we must call what once would have been regarded as merciful and pastoral as antiquated and oppressive. Where will we be another 50 years from now?
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How can you be sure that is not simply because the number of civil divorces has increased? It seems to me natural that if that is the case, faithful Catholics who have examined their consciences might well want to seek annulments? As far as I can see this is a problem over clearing up procedure – except in the rumour mill, where it is the greatest threat since the last greatest threat. I have faith in the Church, and in 50 years it will be where God wants it to be; how could it be otherwise?
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Read the article from Bishop Schneider and find your answers – though it will not satisfy you. I am thoroughly integrated with the JPII and BXVI school of thought as are Pell, Burke and Schneider. Now it may be because of your own experience you have a personal axe to grind which would skew one’s objectivity. But what was feared in the beginning happened during the proceedings and what they fear for the future you will not give the time of day.
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As one who went through it I might be inclined to think that others should. But I still don’t see the evidence for Schneider’s scaremongering.
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That is not scaremongering . . . but it is a good reminder to keep on one’s toes. This battle is not yet over and probably never will be . . . though the enemy is getting quite vocal and visible in our day.
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Cardinal Napier has said on Twitter that the rumours are wrong – but then unlike the ones you mention, he was actually there.
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Indeed . . . I wonder why that was?
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Who knows? But Napier is sound, and he was there. I prefer to accept his word and not spread the scare stories.
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From what I read of Bishop Napier, he was only speaking about the process itself and then went on to agree with the document the he, himself helped write. He seemed to indicate that he was speaking for all the African Bishops as well: I wonder if Sarah is represented by his optimism.
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He’s simo,y saying no one who was present is saying there is any huge change coming. That one is coming from those who having been crying wolf for a year now.
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Nobody is saying that the documents are claiming a huge change coming . . . only that they left the doors open . . . and that if the Pope wants to open it wider he will. As to what future Popes will do is anyone’s guess . . . but a foundation that is built upon this synod (which are merely their insights to the Pope) will give them a lot of room to maneuver.
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I guess those who want to be scared will be so in advance of the facts and without any?
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I don’t know about this being scared stuff: they do not fear the evil they face everyday and most of us are only taking their warnings seriously so that we will not mistake more “spirit of VII” stuff down the line being sold as Magisterial . . . in the spirit of Synod XIV.
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I think the problem here is that the currency is being devalued. Many ordinary people, who don’t follow closely will simply turn off – it will make it more difficult to get them to take it seriously if something is attempted.
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I doubt that those types will ever read a word of what they say . . . their currency is in the Faithful which is a much smaller subset.
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I think Pope Benedict XVI would be helpful on this: http://www.vatican.va/news_services/liturgy/details/ns_lit_doc_20100526_communion_en.html
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I don’t disagree, but he offers zero evidence that when people received in the hand they were not reverent – and says nothing about little wafers. The Church changes disciplines and then people think what is always was; it usually wasn’t.
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Nothing about wafers but you can certainly see the connection with the concern for crumbs. Nobody is claiming we do everything the exact same way that it was done before . . . only that we are guided by the same Spirit to hold the Eucharist in the elevated regard that it deserves. Going backward from hightened reverence is not a forward move but a step backwards.
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Is there a problem known only to the West here? The East has been using bread in the hand for nearly 2000 years without a problem – are we that feeble we need little wafers?
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Maybe we just are more careful than our Eastern brothers. Since the change, I have seen the Precious Blood spilled twice and hosts dropped, left in the pews and even out on the lawn. you tell me that this is acceptable simply because people like it?
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All I can say us that in the East I have never seen such things happen. But my point is a simple one, the church changed its practice, as it does from time to time. Human nature being what is is, I doubt everyone approved.
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And my point is simply that development is a growth in holiness and understanding . . . and regression is a disease that tends to unravel the movement of the Spirit in the Church.
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But I see no evidence in the East that there is a lack of reverence. I have never found sticking my tongue out very reverent.
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Only because you have been raised in a society that sees sticking out one’s tongue as an insult as was I. So why is it that all these folks within Catholic Tradition don’t carry those ideas into their parish? Also, if one is sticking their tongues out that far, they are doing it wrong as it is a subtle extension of the tongue. I have only received on the hands once . . . and that because of a flu outbreak and the pastor asking us to recieve that way. I doubt I would do that again now but at the time . . . I understood his concern. Receiving rather than taking is more reverent and that is the distinction . . . what the East does is their concern. We are more in the world than they are anyway. So the two cases are not identical. I wonder how many converts they get in a year?
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I should have thought that with the wafers any objection to receiving in the hand would be gone. There are no crumbs, and in fact the only time I have seen a wafer drop was when Father misjudged it and the person receiving let it slip. I must be fortunate, but I have never seen all this irreverence at the Altar. I must say I dislike the queues and would like altar rails back.
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Would you really, C, or are you merely being sarcastic? You know that it substantially reduces the problem but that it is not perfect . . . another reason why the chucking of the hand-paten at Communion was a foolish thing.
Yes, you are lucky. Sometimes you don’t see what goes on at the altar or the palming of the Eucharist because you are doing what you and I always do . . . close our eyes in prayer after we receive. That is why it is more common to find the hosts on the floor or out on the lawn than to actually catch the person in the act.
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I really have never seen that here. But would those determined to desecrate hosts will always find a way to do so, alas.
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At least before, they used to break into our churches and pry open the Tabernacle to get their kicks. Now it is as simple as going to your local Novus Ordo Mass.
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I can inly be grateful I have never come across these people.
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I came across their sacrilige not them personally . . . as I say, I don’t want to be the Blessed Sacrament police.
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I’m not really sure that the ‘waver’ is any different than the homemade wholewheat matzohs that are made only with water. That was the traditional seder bread of the Jews. So the change to a bread that is torn rather than broke might have been a novelty though there is nothing I have read to confirm this line of thought. But if true . . . the wafer is a return to the ancient bread used by Christ Who took the bread and broke it.
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As to the Orthodox, correct me if I am wrong, they place the bread in your mouth with a spoon after being intincted with the precious blood . . . no crumbs.
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No, there is no intinction in most Orthodox Churches. The one I attended use to offer you the bread in your hand, just in the manner prescribed by St Cyril (indeed the Missal actually included the quotation from St Cyril about it being the precious body of our Lord and being sure not to let a crumb get lost). That Church also offered the precious blood on a spoon. So again, at some point, some liberal changed that Apostolic practice – how dare they? It is there in the Didache, how dare mere bishops and priests decide to change things? That, genuinely, was the view taken in my old Orthodox Church, where the main arguments against Rome were entirely conservative: Rome added the filioque which was never in the original; Rome offered communion in one kind only, which was never the original practice (I did tell them about Vatican II, but no one was listening!); and they had female extraordinary ministers (utter horror); and they had mandaroty celibacy in the Latin Rite, which was never the original practice.
If I sometimes seem a little sceptical about RC traditionalism, it is because I came out of a real traitionalist community, where they used the St James Liturgy and thought even the St John Chrysostom was novel; as for Trent, goodness me, they could go on for hours about why it was not a proper Mass – something abput epiclesis could keep ’em going for an hour by itself. 🙂
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I’m sure it would . . . though we still can see the development . . . always toward a more reverent and careful practice. If you think that restorational theology is the answer I would suggest you start your own Church. 🙂
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The Orthodox Church I belonged to had changed nothing, so there was no restorationism involved. They found the Catholic argument about development Jesuitical – I kid you not, they used just that word! 🙂
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well now there hitting below the belt. I won’t let anyone get away with calling me Jesuitical. 🙂
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they’re not there…purely Jesuitical! 🙂
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For me the “group hug” is appropriate since we are a community, we are church, how better to indicate that than with a hug rather than a mere handshake, wave of the hand or nod.
At our Masses, we use unleavened bread, rarely a crumb escapes the hand and ordinary red wine.
I’m sure this scandalizes some…too bad.
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Depends if the matter is according to the teaching of the Church. No addition of honey or other sweeteners and for the wine, naturally fermented without preservatives.
As to the group hug . . . the sign of peace was meant to be a grasping of elbow and shoulder . . . but alas, there is no rubric for it, is there. I will bet you that although we sometimes think that we are ‘community’ because of these things, we are not ‘Community’ as we were in the older unity . . . having, following and sharing our Catholic culture that was unique from the world and from other breakaway faiths. We have thrown away our Catholic Culture for a local one.
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I am not sure who is proposing anything more than that the process should be less difficult of access and less protracted. Why should either of these things be bad or subvery anything? How many current applications for annulment get refused would you say?
I doubt anyone goes for an annulment lightly, and it would be surprising if thoughful people who, having considered the situation and gone down that route, were not found to have contracted an invalid marriage. Where are these hordes of people who will rush to the tribunals? And where is the evidence that the new proposals are going to undermine Church teaching – except, that is, in the minds of those who have been saying this from day 1 and will carry on saying it whatever the actual evidence shows across time?
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The annulment itself was a great leap forward . . . though with every inch given a mile is next demanded. As to how many annulments given . . . in the world far less than the U.S. grants. We comprise about 90% of them if memory serves . . . but that I believe is because we still have people going to Church on Sunday unlike much of Europe. As to difficulty, let me answer it like this (sorry if it is a bit long-winded):
Life is hard. And some are harder than others. We seem to live in an age of egalitarianism, where we expect and demand equal outcomes. However, Christ never promised such to anyone. He did say that there are two prerequisites to following Him: denying yourself and picking up your cross . . . He certainly did not say that the denial of oneself is of equal difficulty or that the crosses we each bear will be of equal size and weight. Today, it seems that we would change Christ’s words to simply forget the prerequisites and simply follow Him . . . give up nothing, make it easier for everyone. The rich man couldn’t give up his greatest sin . . . his love of money. Shouldn’t Christ have called him back and said, forget that, as it is too hard for you . . . I will grant you mercy because it is too difficult? After all it’s not fair when others have nothing much to give up.
Consequences of particular sins are not equal and one might say they differ from individual to individual. Yet the grace to effect change in your life and circumstance is equal to the task: that is what we believe. In other words, Christ’s mercy is in the giving of the grace to deny your own desires and overcome your unwillingness to suffer for love of Him . . . and the strength to carry your cross, whether it is a small, easy to carry cross or a large heavy one. He is there to help you and so is the Church. But He nor the Church is going to let you get a pass on the prerequisites to follow Him. Following Christ exacts a toll, though not the same toll, on everyone.
My reaction as to the title of this post might best be characterized by Chester A. Riley (Wm. Bendix): “What a revoltin’ development this is.” 🙂
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If you were arguing against annulments per se, there would be a lot to be said for the line you take here. After all, nowehere in the Gospel does Jesus qualify what he says on marriage to add: ‘no divorce, but if you repent and can convince the Church tribunal that your marriage was invalid, that’s quite anothe thing – go right ahead.’ So the Church does not say what you say here, it does not say you must find the Grace to live this way now. It uses its powers of binding a loosing to offer mercy.
That being so, how it provides that mercy is a matter of discipline and not doctrine, so, again, I am not sure what you are arguing against here, as the thrust seems to be against the whole idea of an annulment.
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No, I am not. Just like female priests and JPII’s statement that we have not the ability to allow them . . . so is marriage (if it is a marriage – that is bound in heaven) which we cannot tear asunder. However, we know that not every marriage is bound in heaven for it requires the freewill of both partners and the understanding that marriage is indissoluble. Thereby we do have the ability to offer a process to evaluate the marriage to determine, as best as we can, if it was in fact a Christian marriage or not. It is not unlike the fact that the Church has a process to deal with anti-popes as well . . . and declare them as such. Christ said nothing about this as well . . . but they came along as we well know. So, saying that Christ did not speak of nullity regarding marriage does not mean that nullity does not exist . . . but that in such an important teaching we must assume that the marriage is valid, like we assume that our Pope was elected validly, until we have determined that this is probably not the case. It is no mercy to change a practice to something which is divorced (pun intended) from teaching.
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I agree, but that is the teaching of the Church, founded upon mercy and not on the very words Christ spoke. The Church interprets what Jesus says about marriage just as you describe. If nullity exists, the Church will find it so, so again, I am not quite sure what it is you are objecting to?
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I abject to this being simplified to the exclusion of a need for a tribunal or an adherence to Church Law that has been built upon many, many years of experience in these matters. Are we to throw that wisdom in the rubbish heap and simply let a Kasper say to a couple . . . your past marriage is null and void because I said so and you confessed that you are sorry for remarrying before you knew whether you were adulterer or not? It seems a bit slip-shod to say the least. Perhaps each bishop will be able to decide upon the criteria they will use as well. Then maybe each bishop can decide if they accept the Pope as Pope or reject him as an antipope. That would be interesting. 🙂
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That’s one way of looking at it. Here’s another. Are we to say to an African couple that the Church will show them mercy, but unfortunately because ere isn’t a tribunal anywhere near them, if they put their case together – not, of course that there is anyone to help them – it can go to a tribunal to some far place where there is one; of course if they were American, that wouldn’t apply, but the Church is going with the first world model where its richest bishops live?
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What have they been doing until now? I dare say the African bishops would not agree with you nor are they asking for change. Lets face it, all we know about proceedings such as this is limited to our understanding of Church practice and law as well as that which we might have some personal experience. Should the whole Church for some hypothetical situation that might show up at a weather station in Antartica?
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What they have been doing up to now comprises a veriety of things. In some places a form of polygamy is tacitly permitted – documentation being what it is in parts of Africa, there often is none, in which case, as no one can prove anything one way or the other, priests wave it by. Others, take a harder view. So there is already a variety of practice. I’d have thought a Universal Church should try to get some kind of order here?
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Order naturally restores itself once the Faith is established and people are getting baptized, confirmed and married in their parish. Then they will have records and a tribunal. You want to effect change to the whole to take care of exceptions. As I say, I doubt you’ll find much support among the African priests.
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I am not quite sure what this huge change you think is happening is. Does it exist outside the rumour-mill?
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After all that happened you still do not see a problem? Maybe you can put aside your half-way between Pell and Kasper hat for a moment and read this from Bishop Schneider – though I know you think of him an Burke as wild-eyed trouble makers.
http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2015/11/rorate-exclusive-bishop-athanasius.html#more
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I am afraid that I do think both those bishops need tin foil hats. Since when we it the job of bishops to scare the sheep? It is clear that those who wanted a Kasperite solution lost, and those who can’t trust the Pope to do the right thing will continue to exist in a fermet of anxiety. I really am not sure what good it does. If the Pope does try to pull a fast one, then there are an awful lot of people who will call him on it.
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You live on a different planet than BXVI did then . . . as both were highly regarded and still are by our last Pontif. The job of a good Shepherd is to protect the sheep and hand over the same Church to the lambs that was given to them. They rightfully point out wolves, sheep in wolves clothing and hirelings if they are known. Bravo for them.
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That is certainly one way of looking at it. 😄
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🙂
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Last sentence: I left out the clause, (change its practice) after the world Church . . .
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But there is already a wide variety of practice, so again, I am not quite sure what is going to change. Where is the evidence that there is this huge backlog of people who are now going to come forward with annulments?
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How about everyone, who unlike you, walked away during the process because it was too hard? You don’t think that they are already standing in line? All it took was for the idea that changes were coming for parishes to start seeing SSM folks asking for communion as well. Once the door is cracked open, you think it will only open for one, particular compaintant?
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I genuinely have no idea how many did, and if they did because the process was broken, is it not a bright idea to fix it? This has nothing to do with SSM folk, who know the rules and, as far as I can see, no one in authority is proposing we change them, are they?
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It is you, Kasper and the German Bishops that say it is broken. I think it too lenient . . . at least, here in the U.S.
Apparently, you did not read the interventions during the synod which brought up women as deacons, allowing those who live together without being married, and those who are in homosexual relationships access to the sacraments as well. There is an agend here and this synod and its document will not stop it . . . and the Pope will make sure that it doesn’t.
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And I will add to what Dave objects to, as to be so brave. The pope’s September 18 disaster assumes that all marriages are invalid and lets only one party agree with this, and the list of reasons why the marriage may be invalid, which I might point out, end with “and so on.” So, when you couple this with what all by now ‘know’ what the pope wants, more love and mercy, yes, each confessor will be approving annulments for different reasons. Current practice, Church discipline is that all marriages are valid, and obtains statements from both parties which the CHURCH evaluates with Christ’s words in mind and at it’s heart.
In others words, the individual will now decide what is the doctrine and discipline of the Sacraments of Matrimony and the Eucharist, not the Church. Go ahead and argue with that word ‘doctrine’ if you will, but in reality, which Eugenio Scalfari has stated, and the Vatican has long since proven to be the exact thought, if not the exact words of our pope: “This is bottom line result, the de facto appraisals are entrusted to the confessors, but at the end of faster or slower paths, all the divorced who ask will be admitted.”
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Bravo!
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Indeed there is a difference between development and destruction: one builds up and the other tears down. It seems rather simple to me . . . but then I’m not one of those fancy theologians.
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They might have their buildings at that but one might say they have lost all their marbles. 🙂
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We must be nice or else they will unleash their wrath.
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And muzzled, if you can believe it. The fury is only about to begin.
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The key words there are ‘as R fears’ – I deprecate the premature stirring up of fears which may be unnecessary. Quite what use such things are I cannot say, but it seems unnecessary.
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Done.
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If you haven’t seen it, Fr. Z had a bit of fun with the Ross Douthat piece today as well:
http://wdtprs.com/blog/2015/11/ross-douthat-explains-the-situation-to-liberal-catholic-academics/
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Loved that – thank you, I had missed it!
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I though you’d get a laugh out of that. 🙂
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Yes, I sent Faggioli a link to Newman on development, and suggested that he re-read Nicaea to see that the word he thought meant divorcee meant widow. Man calls himself a scholar! Needs a refresher course himself!
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Ahh the state of our universities is frightful I’m afraid. I am sure that you will now be an intolerant hater for bringing that up.
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Did you watch the video of Ross’s lecture for First Things? Fr. Z has a link in his article and his talk, I thought, was quite to the point.
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As the first of Fr. Z’s commenters said: Douhart is on it again. Bullseye!
God bless this good man for writing the utter truth.
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His lecture was great, wasn’t it?
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Come on C, can’t you see!
As I stated yesterday, “you are all over the board!” You start out on both sides with Churchill by comparing his courage and judgement. You end in your last paragraph about the pope stating: “(if that is what went on) & (if it is his position)” I get the impression that very soon you will be quoting former President Bill Clinton when he so famously stated: “it depends on what the meaning of ‘is’, is.”
I think two of Douthat’s paragraphs may help.
“I hope we can agree that current controversies in Roman Catholicism cry out for explanation. And not only for Catholics: The world is fascinated — as it should be — by Pope Francis’ efforts to reshape our church. [Undeniable.] But the main parties in the church’s controversies have incentives to downplay the stakes. Conservative Catholics don’t want to concede that disruptive change is even possible. [Naive.] Liberal Catholics don’t want to admit that the pope might be leading the church into a crisis. [Blind.]”
“Now it may be that today’s heretics are prophets, the church will indeed be revolutionized, and my objections will be ground under with the rest of conservative Catholicism. But if that happens, it will take hard grinding, not just soft words and academic rank-pulling. It will require a bitter civil war.
And so, my dear professors: Welcome to the battlefield.”
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Douthat is a good journalist, but like most of his tribe, he over simplifies. Churchill was brave, but his judgment was not good much of the time. Douthat is a good journalist, but the situation is more like the one I described on Friday. I don’t think the binary division reflects reality, although it reflects how some think about it.
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Well this is going on in popular US culture: http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/11/03/us/illinois-district-violated-transgender-students-rights-us-says.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&referer=
But by all means, let’s continue the Chicken Little parade over whether an annulment should take 6 months or 18… because that’s what’s going to drive people to embrace Satan…
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I do not think the XIV Synod on the Family has anything to do with how long it should take for an annulment . . . I wish that were the case.
Your example brings to mind an anology most fitting however. There was a time when the Church was the Analyst in the World Assylum for the insane . . . offering another way to view things . . . and a stability in life. Today it seems we have come to the conclusion (not all . . . but most) that the inmates are sane and it us who are rather mad.
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As I keep saying, I’m entirely unconvinced by the chicken little stuff, which seems to me code for fears about this Pope. I am, like you, far more worried about the other stuff. Of course, when the girls eventually bring a case against the transgendered person, the State will be sued any way!
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